Hi everyone.
This is just a quick note to advise you all that on Sunday I am heading off to the USA for two and a half weeks. So the blog and AGB twitter will be on hold until after the 23rd of November. Feel free to discuss gym matters in the comments of this post. But I will still check in on them, as my primary email is where all comments are cc'd. So I advise you, as always, to keep it civil. I look forward to hearing good things out of National Clubs.
If you have matters regarding competition start lists or scores for anything in the upcoming period, please contact your gymnast's club or your state associaton first before making an open query here.
Cheers.
I'll bring you back summin' nice.
Wednesday, October 31, 2012
Subscribe to:
Post Comments (Atom)
203 comments:
1 – 200 of 203 Newer› Newest»The news today is that future Australian Olympians may have to sign a "I have never doped" stat dec if they want to compete at the Olympics.
http://www.smh.com.au/sport/olympians-to-sign-no-doping-stat-dec-aoc-20121102-28o61.html
I know nothing about doping, but was wondering is there any point in a gymnast doping? I can't imagine that it would help a gymnast's body in the way it might help in other sports.
The only doping charges I've ever seen against gymnasts have been for diaretics (sp?) to help them lose weight/maintain a low weight.
Nah, no point. Dieretics is most common in rhythmic- in artistic I think it would harm more than help, especially in the current code of points. Diuretics aren't going to help you pull around an Amanar are they? I think the bigger issue with diuretics is that they can mask use of other drugs.
The reason why artistic gymnastics will never be a 'doping' sport is because for every gain you make from doping, there would be a loss that would impact your scores just as much. i.e. You might gain that extra strength and power to pull around a harder tumbling pass, but you still have to control the landing. That extra boost of energy to make your final tumbling run will also make it harder to concentrate on your beam routine. Even though it makes scoring a massive pain, the fact that gymnastics is so complicated and requires so many different types of athletic skill works in its favour when it comes to doping. All the sports that get hit worst with doping problems are the ones that are relatively simple in skill and depend on brute strength or sheer endurance- cycling, running, weightlighting, swimming.
Enjoy your holiday, Mez! Hope you're not going to New Jersey :)
Funnily enough, Anon, I am! No joke! But not the coastal bit. All signs point to good at my friend's place. :)
Thanks for the thoughtful responses on doping. You have confirmed what my suspicions were - that any power increases would just make it harder to control other things. A gymnast doesn't just need brute strength, they also need finesse.
What about men's gymnastics???
Hi everyone, just letting you know that I have uploaded some junior videos from Nationals to my Youtube channel: mrsangeandbella. Any help with gymnast identification would be gratefully received! Sorry that there aren't more of them -- my camera died very shortly after arriving.
Ange
thanks ange! I watched them this morning when I woke up before gym
there was one girl from Queensland I think, on beam, 2nd video I think
I don't recognise her but her form was fantastic!
Along with eliza freeman (large cheer squad!)
Glad to see the future looking good
thanks again!
The Qld gymnast on beam is Grace Sheppard. She does have great form and is lovely to watch on floor as well as beam.
I've been watching a lot of older (for eg, the 90s lol) gymnastics videos on youtube lately and was pleasantly reminded of how many gymnasts dismounted both floor AND beam with full-twisting double backs. I really miss seeing them at the end of a routine! It's just so impressive to watch. And it got me wondering why we rarely see these skills thrown as dismounts anymore. Is it the code of points, or do gymnasts not have quite the same level of stamina these days or what?
Here's a question for Aus gym followers. Are there any "Jordyn Wiebers" in your system yet? and if not , would you care to speculate when one would appear, say 10-12 years from now?
Well first we have to figure out which coach can be a total ****, then look at their gymnasts to see who might be our 'Wieber'
9:32 - good one! lol
8:54 - yeah coz Wieber really lived up to all the hype at the olympics didn't she.
What gymnastic programs are under review following the after math of the olympic games ? i heard peggy has been visiting IDP program organisers around Australia to improve but also put pressure on current programs to get better results!
Hopefully all of them! Has Peggy still got her job?
If Peggy is still Head National Coach nothing will get better, good that she's gone!!!
Jordyn is still a super star and out scores all Australians by miles! She was just unlucky
We'll get our 'Wieber' when our population is comparable to the USA's (increases from 22 million to 314 million).
When is the USA going to get their 'Komova' or 'Mustafina'? ie. a gymnast with actual grace and artistry? :Q
Yes but boring compared to the power gymnasts. Unless your a Nanna and prefer the artistry without the power. I think both power and artistry is the future of gymnastics.
I'm fairly sure population has nothing to do with hard work and good coaching to create an amazing gymnast.
To the Jordyn Wieber fanatic -
Who are you, her little sister? If you idolize her so much perhaps you should be commenting on a site dedicated to her, or at least USA gymnastics. Your comments are getting reaaally boring *Yawn*
I have heard the QLD HPC programs are on notice and coaches stood down. Anybody know what has happened?
Omg What!! What is Going on???
Speaking of gymnasts from the 90's, these are 2 of my all time favourite Aussie gymnasts from that era........
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3_0UzR7_5rE
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=K-ytO8aDBW8
Was that Peggy Liddick commentating during the Joanna Hughes routine?
Peggy Browne - former CEA of Gymnastics Australia.
That Jo Hughes floor routine is one of my all-time favourites!
The Qld HPC is under review in line with Gymnastics Australia's review and as such all coaching positions have been readvertised, including MAG and WAG. That means that all coaching spots at the HPC including head coaches are up for grabs.
Even the Vic HPC has positioned advertised on sportspeople
Where are the Qld positions advertised??? seems like state after state is doing a shakeup? good for all
They are advertised on sportspeople.com.
Is such a shakeup a common thing to happen to Australian high performance programs after an Olympic competition? Did it happen after Beijing?
Just been looking on the VWHPC website and noticed that it has not been updated in a while ????
Loved Jo Hughes' floor. It was even better that Liz wasn't commentating. Didn't even have to hit mute!
Jobs are the Vic HPC are also advertised: http://www.sportspeople.com.au/sp/position/PositionDisplay.asp?ID=21861
Interesting that it is only upto IDP 8 that they are looking for. This is the area that they are proberly having the most trouble. I think the senior coaches are OK as the girls from VWHPC have done all right.
Anon: 12:29
Were do you think the senior/Junior girls were initially? most of the girls that are doing well have come from the lower squads pre Nadia/Tatiana days, and all the others have come from interstate and other clubs.
Its a shame that their not advertising the Programme managers position, thats were the problem is.
Really your blog articles is awesome.by the way If you have ever wondered what gym supplements you should try for your fat loss goals then come with us.for more information clikc here: http://gymsupplements.in/
Has anyone ever had problems at Waverley is it a good club . The girls in Idp seem to do quite well there ! From a parent looking for advice ?
Don't read all the comments here. They are usually by waverly people. At the end of the day you want to look at the success at the junior and senior levels and the HPC has a long history of success. Waverly is a club while the HPC is a high performance centre and they have very different operating styles. As a parent you should look at both options and judge what is best for you. If you care about results at the lower levels go wherever but if you are looking at a long term time then look at both and see which style suits you best.
One thing that appeals to me about Waverley is that it seems like it has a good national levels program as well as IDP. Given how few IDP girls actually stay in elite through to senior for various reasons I imagine it would be an easier transition to national levels than if leaving a HPC. Also, because they have rec classes subsidising the IDP kids they don't need to "keep the numbers up" like they do in HPCs. So many kids are kept for far too long in high performance programs without any real chance of making international teams. These kids miss out on the opportunity to have a rewarding career in national levels (or another sport) as a result.
As for Waverly I have no direct experience but they seem to have done a good job with Angela and Eliza as well as obviously their 2008 cycle athletes. As for performance at the "business end" they have had 3 appearances in the Olympics by 2 gymnasts over the last 8 years. Who has the VWHPC had apart from Ashleigh? Their "long history of success" must have been a while ago.
HPC had Ashleigh plus 2 reserves in Maryanne and Georgia rose. In 2008 was Ashleigh, in 2004 they had Monette Russo, Karen Nguyen and Steph Moorhouse and in 2000 they had Trudy McIntosh, brook Walker and Melinda Cleeland and Zeena was a reserve. That's a pretty good track record for Olympics. Not to mention commonwealth games and worlds. If my daughter was at that level I would be happy for her to be at the HPC
Fair enough. I think the point was made earlier that most of those girls did not train at the HPC early on. So when you are talking about seniors making teams who trained at the HPC as say 10 - 12 year olds, isn't Ashleigh the only senior? I agree though - If they were to be trained by Mischa and Tracy it seems like a pretty good deal. Who was coaching the 10-12 year olds in the 90's? Because their kids obviously did very well in 2000 and 2004.
I heard MBC in QLD has closed their IDP program as well. Seems there will be a few more coaches looking for jobs! What's going on up there? They seemed to have a lot of potentials in the IDP ranks
MBC international gymnastics is a school based program with economic times being tough and gymnastics costing lots of money and little gymnasts in the program you can imagine if a school had to cost cut where they would start unfortunately for those coaches and gymnasts it was their program !
That's a shame where will those gymnasts go are they still competing at national clubs?
The girls are competing at National Clubs and no doubt they will end up back at the Qld HPC, if the new coaches accept them. Doesn't matter how good they are, as all of the gymnasts positions are under review. Oh happy days!!!
The High performance Centre is just that a High performance program for high performing gymnasts so it won't matter who you are and where you've come from if your performing well your position will be safe at QHPC whether your from MBC or QHPC if the gymnasts aren't quite keeping up and are injured all the time then worry!! It would be the same everywhere in Australia It certainly works that way at our gym everyone is always under review which can be quite stressful !
The injured MBC girls can move to the VWHPC, they always hold on to injured girls, for years, even though they dont show results...LOL
I didn't realize that you had to give up your dream just because your injured so that you can please the cynical trolls on these websites
No one is really injured at MBC you have your info wrong you might be talking about QAS ??
I thought QAS only just got new coaches (or am I wrong??)I feel sorry for the gymnasts - how can they EVER settle? Not sure how I would feel if my daughter's coaches kept changing all of the time
A total change of subject.....
Did anyone else see this little snippet?
http://fulltwist.net/10-minutes-with-mary-anne-monckton/?utm_source=twitterfeed&utm_medium=twitter&utm_campaign=Feed%3A+FullTwist+%28Full+Twist%29
Oh - that's a good interview - also noticed Kiara Munteanu (junior) afterwards http://fulltwist.net/10-minutes-with-kiara-munteanu-aus/
Think it's great for Ozzie's to be noticed!!
No-one's done an Australian junior for The Couch Gymnast's junior watch yet... Hint hint. ;-)
anon 5:35 - sense of humour much? lol
The coaches at QAS are involved in their own little power struggle or so I've heard.
I've been hangin' to see which Aussie junior gets mentioned on TCG too!
Who are the current Australian juniors, and who is about to become a junior?
Completely random question: does anyone know what the old IDP 4 and 6 floor music was? I'm talking almost 10 years ago when it used to be called stage 4 and stage 6?
There was never a stage 6. It use to be stage 1-4. The old stage 3 is equivalent to today's Idp 6 and stage 4 is equivalent to today's Idp 8. Not sure of what the music is called, however I remember it well.
Does anyone know why the VWHPC is totally unrepresented at this years National Clubs or at the GA IDP camp which follows, to be held in their own gym?
Does anyone know why the VWHPC is totally unrepresented at any level at this years National Clubs or at the GA IDP which follows in their own gym?
That discussion about the HPC has already been had. I don't think it has anything to do with the gymnasts or the centre in a negative way it's just bad timing with everything that is going on from a management point of view. They are advertising coach positions and as this is post Olympics they always re look at squads and goals at this time of year after an Olympics. It's just a planning phase, don't read too much into it.
be really nice to see a coach or 3 leave a hpc and move to a regional area and develop gymnastics!!!
A HPC coach belongs in a HPC centre. A junior development coach belongs in the regional areas to get the girls ready to come and join a HPC.
What a strange comment 8:31? If you sent highly qualified coaches to regional areas - what would happen to the local coaches??
that's half the problem in regional areas ... we can't get ANY coaches ... so the kids are just unable to continue ... not all are in the position to move to the capitals to try the hpc system ... what's being done to develop our coaches????
Thats the sacifices that are made to be part of the HPC. Some parents travel over 2hr everyday to send the daughters/son into town.
Any news out of national clubs yet? (assuming any gymnasts are actually going. Haha. Ha. Ha.)
There is a participant list up. 5 seniors including Liv Viv, 4 juniors - all from WA and NSW, 7 IDP 10's - 4 WA , 2 NSW and one from VIC. Good news for 2020 is that there are heaps of 5's and 6's.
where is the participant list?
Hidden on the Gym Vic website here;
http://www.gymnasticsvictoria.org.au/site/gymnastics/vic/downloads/events/GV%20Event%20Info/2012%20Events/12_WAG_NC_Competitor_List.pdf
I found it through the event page under competition information.
More than we usually get for national clubs though. Does anyone know if there is a Facebook page?
Just been watching some of the videos from Combs La Ville. The Canadian and French juniors (and Espoir/pre-juniors) look aMAZing! I hope we can keep up with them.
9.46 you are a gem! We have printed out the list to take with us to Geelong. Thanks!
12 competitors from IDP 10 - Senior.
Half of these were from WA - the state with the furthest to travel!
Stella and Isis the only Victorians. Pretty ordinary when you are hosting.
I agree
Maybe they need to do less major competitions for practice
Keep the excuses coming- personally I think you don't deserve to complain about lack of international competition if you don't bother to show up to local competitions. I'm not saying that gymnasts who have earnt their stripes such as Lauren need to show up at every competition in the country, but there is absolutely no way any of these young seniors should be gunning to represent this country internationally if they haven't shown they can cut it in the smaller leagues. Once a year at Nationals and a couple of verifications at camps do not make a battle-hardened athlete. If the coaches won't take them, then I hope they do get passed over for coaches that are prepared to get their gymnasts out and competing.
Here's my two reports from today, if they help any;
IDP 8: http://www.thecouchgymnast.com/?p=7585
IDP 10, Jr and Sr: http://www.thecouchgymnast.com/?p=7588
With regards to keeping up with every one else at comps like Combs La Ville, Australia has to be invited first! Unfortunately our not placing in the top 8 at Olympcs will probably have a big effect on whether we can attend a lot of international comps in the future. Hopefully GA will be all sorted by then and the new CEO will get things on track again all across Australia. Wonder if we will also have a new Head Coach soon?
Is Peggy at National clubs? Such a sad turn out of Juniors and Seniors, not really a good representation of the talent we have . But I can also understand our Seniors wanting to rest, it's been a long,hard 4 years and more on their bodies and National clubs i s not really that important in the whole scheme of things for them. Selection for AYOF will be interesting. I think WAIS will be the bulk of the Team! They seem to have some talent coming up in the ranks.
In response to the Couch Gynbast report, yes Molly Mckenzie is returning from an injury-riddled 3 years. Her bars are technically beautiful and once she gets her full programme back she will be one to watch
I really hope some videos from Nat. Clubs surface.
Scrap that last comment. Videos are already going up on Mrsagneandbella's youtube site ;)
where are Emma medic and jazminne cassis?
Sorry about the video quality -- hopefully I do a little better tonight. I was devastated to miss all the seniors on floor, too -- especially Olivia Vivian.
Tonight I am going to make an extra special effort to get Darcy Norman's bars, too -- my friends said it was one of the best routines of the night. She looked amazing, really one to watch.
Ange (mrsangeandbella on YouTube)
Thanks Ange - i went looking for Darcy Norman's bars on your channel! Appreciate all your efforts :)
Thanks Ange - appreciate you capturing what you can for those o us who can't!
Who's Emma Medic?
My understanding is that Emma Nedov (yes, my phone just autocorrected to medic as well) and Jazminne are injured.
Pretty sure the above poster was referring to Emma Nedov.
oh sorry i didnt even see that my phone auto corrected - i did mean emma nedov
I am so over L. Mitchell, when is she going to retire already?
Where the heck did that come from?
What has Lauren done for you to be so " over" her.
She has lifted the profile of Australian gymnastics more than anyone has. You won't find a more committed and dedicated Gymnast to her sport than Lauren. She is a very selfless person who is a wonderful mentor .She has an amazing work ethic. Even if you don't like her gymnastics, you can't argue with what she has done for the sport. It's just a shame that a lot of the hard work done by her high profile won't be capitalized on by GA because of thier lack of direction at the moment and the fact that we didn't place at the Olympics. I can't see many Seniors in Australia at the moment who can take her place to keep the profile going. Who do you think should replace Lauren as our top gymnast? Not only on the floor but as a committed and hard working gymnast for the sport.
I'll be a bit sad if Lauren retires. We've always had a new star when somebody retires- Joanna, Lisa, Allana, Monette, Hollie, Dasha, Lauren... now what? We don't seem to have another with that mix of star quality, high difficulty and consistency to step up.
Yet.
Yes, Australia is a bit lost for the next rising star. Maybe GRB ? I only say this because she seems to be the only one from the 2012 cycle who made it to competing after the Olympics. She still has a long way to go to be a Lauren or Monette etc.
Yes, must agree with the last couple of comments. I have just watched the Seniors that competed at National clubs and was very surprised at the poor quality. I had been looking forward to watching Oliva Vivian as I have heard a bit about how "Entertaining" she is, but I didn't enjoy her floor at all. The music is awful and so is the choreography. Better suited to College Gymnastics that's for sure. Her execution leaves a lot to be desired, split leaps on beam were very low and although she made a full routine on day 1 on bars I wasn't impressed with day 2. Sadly I think these Seniors don't fall into the category of rising stars like Lauren etc. Agree that GRB is perhaps one that could move into this position.Also maybe Angela? Who else?
In the short term, we're stuffed.
Next year is an individual worlds so it really doesn't matter. The following year the 98 girls will be senior and hopefully some of them will have a world class program. A lot can change in 2 years which is how long we have until we need to field a team again for worlds and commonwealth games.
With so many of our Seniors injured or recovering they will probably move more into specializing . It will be AA we will be short of. Any one know who is moving into Senior next year? Doesn't seem to be many Juniors either.
You can worry if you want, but I wouldn't be basing those worries on National Clubs. The competition was very poorly attended by our HPC's and National team members. There were some bright spots: the young WAIS girls showed wonderful preparation and great potential. Gillian Chan is shaping up to be a strong vaulter and tumbler, and has some interesting skills on bars. darcy Norman is clean, polished, expressive and has the extra "it" factor. Her bars are really very impressive for her age -- in fact, tha lasrt Australian gymnast competing comparable skills at that age was Allana Slater. Paige James is looking to be a solid all arounder. Olivia Vivian showed amazing team spirit and demonstrated the value of team relationships and mutual support. She was selfless in her encouragement of all the other athletes. I don't know if you will see a single gymnast from this National Clubs on any of our major teams between now and Rio. Normally I would be fretting over the loss of an opportunity for competition experience, but we are at the end of an Olympic cycle, the new Code has been released and our gymnasts are rightly in the midst of either having a well-earned break or reworking their routines to meet the demands of the new Code. Half the WORLD doesn't even show up for post-Olympic WORLDS, for goodness sake.
Like I said, there may be grounds to worry, but National Clubs isn't it.
Totally agree with the last post. To be honest, I think it would have been better with no Seniors competing. These girls were obviously not competition ready . They would have been better to take advantage of the down time and concentrate on updating.Sadly the videos will be posted Internationaly and they are not a good indication of our talent. Totally agree about the young talent coming up, they have a long road ahead of them, some are fairly young.After watching what happened with 2012 cycle girls with only 1 girl from that cycle in the team,hope they can keep thier bodies intact for a number of years.
I'm glad to read that I am not the only one not keen on Olivia's floor routine. I was watching and was looking forward to seeing her. Yes she was very entertaining, she obviously likes the spotlight. But I don't like the music and thought some of the moves are maybe not appropriate for international stream. I hope she changes it for next year. After watching her I can understand why she perhaps missed out on selection for the Olympic team. I must say that I would not have liked to have seen that routine follow Lauren's on an Olympic stage. But you can't fault her enthusiasm.
And how are the IDP 5s and 6s going? Who are the exciting prospects there?
Thought people might be interested in this post from National Clubs 4 years ago - same lack of attendance as this year.
http://ozgymnastics.blogspot.com.au/2008/11/national-clubs-2008.html?m=1
As for prospects in IDP 5 & 6 it is way too soon to tell. These kids will be 18 and 19 (mostly) in 2020 and most of them will be gone.
In 2008 Brittany Boffo won IDP 6 and went on to win IDP 8 at nationals the next year. Definitely a top 2016 prospect now not in the sport.
In fact if you have a look at IDP 6 and 8 from 2009 nationals - equivalent to the girls competing 5 & 6 at this national clubs most of the top girls have moved on.
Of the 16 girls in IDP 8 - I think 4 are still training and Isis is the only one who competed this week.
Of the 32 IDP 6's only about 7 are still training and Darcy and Gillian are the only one we saw at national clubs.
It will be a few years before we will have any idea of front runners for 2020.
Has anyone any idea when the National Coach position will be announced
Brittany Boffo was told to leave by the Qld HPC management. (Not Vlad J) Reason given..."she is too old (just turned 14) to 'make it' as a snr". At 12 she already had the full compliment of skills to compete jnrs.
regards, Karen Boffo
Wow Karen, I'm sorry to hear that. I used Brittany as an example because I remember how talented she was. I assumed she had left like many do, either injured or wanting to pursue something else.
Anyone looking at the 2016 eligible girls in 2009 would have assumed that Brittany would be around when the time came. The point I was trying to make is that of the kids doing well in IDP 6 now, most of them will move on in the next few years.
I hope Brittany has found another outlet for her obvious talent.
To anon 5:38 Thank you for your kind words. Although Brittany has not ventured into another sport (gymnastics was her passion) she is doing well and enjoying life.
Karen
re: Brittany Boffo being told to leave - Qld HPC management seriously need their heads read!
You are welcome. Glad she is enjoying life - hard to think what could be more important than that. As for being too old - did they only just work out how old she is? I get really annoyed that the coaches often focus on the kids in the middle of the cycle - and the parents of the older ones are never told that they will be considered "too old" for their cycle at some point. Considering the age of the majority of our Olympic team it seems to me that they are applying eastern bloc policy in a country where it basically takes until 19 to peak anyway so who cares what year you are born!
I think it sounds like GQ management is making all the decisions, who's on the board? What's with opening up the coaches jobs when they have so many in top IDP levels - and the Joura's in such little time!!Or have they spilled all of them too?? None at Nat Clubs, I wonder... Something's off up there folks I'd be asking questions!! Brittany - I think we could find room for a talented gymnast such as yourself - don't let politics and people who 'think' they know, steal your dream!
The problem in Qld is that the majority of the board is made up of national level coaches who resent the international program . IDP is the lowest regarded and the national girls take preceedence !
You might find that there were other reasons why Brittany was asked to leave. For example she didn't want to do gym anymore (her words) and secondly her attitude towards coaches and her training. (not so good). She had so much talent but it wasn't enough. I really hope is enjoying her time away from gymnastics. So before bagging the gym, I thought it was important to give an inside the gym perspective rather than an outside one.
If you are an inside gym source you should put your name to your post like Karen did.
Name me a gymnast over the age of 13 who hasn't said at some point that they don't want to do gym - I think you'll find it is a very small group.
Same goes for training attitude - I think you'll find teenage girls a difficult group in and out of the gym.
My guess is your "inside perspective" is that you are the mother of a girl younger than Brittany who has yet to face the difficulties associated with training as a teenager. I hope you are shown more compassion when your daughter meets the puberty fairy!
If I'm wrong and you are an actual inside source who had something to do with this decision then shame on you - how completely unprofessional to divulge the reasons behind this decision.
Coward.
Brittany got on well with the Jouras and maintains the utmost respect for them.
She was not put out because of "attitudinal" issues.
Training was limited due to a shin splint+wrist injury so confidence was low. Management was made aware that full medical clearance was pending. It came 1 wk of her leaving. The directive to put her out came from higher up the Qld food chain.
Karen
So if they are asking talented gymnasts to leave because of injuries, how is it that the Coaches daughters are able to stay in when one has suffered injury after injury and the other came back from years off and walked back int the program training with a fatigue disorder. Think that is an issue in itself.
I think it starting to go a bit far now. It is unfair to comment if you only one half of the story and also unfair to mention problems of other gymnasts who probably don't appreciate their conditions spoken about. Especially when everyone knows who you are taking about.
Why on earth would a parent discuss such issues in a public forum..., said as a former parent - Victoria.
All sorts of innuendo and rumour is brought up in this blog - ignore it as most sane gymnasts and parents do.
Agreed it had sarted to get way too personal. However I don't see that Karen has done anything wrong here - only stating first hand information as she sees it. Other posters anonymously taking shots at her and now at the jouras are way out of line.
To Karen, I'm sorry I am the poster who started all this in response to someone's question about who looks good in IDP 6, 8years out from their cycle's Olympics. I had no idea that Brittany had recently finished as we haven't seen her interstate for some time. I didn't intend to cause this discussion but I did so I'm sorry.
If Brittany still loves gym - Queensland has some terrific gyms - I hope she gets a chance to shine again. Elite gym is not the only or even the best option available sometimes.
To get away from this conversation. On the GV website on the report for national clubs it says that it was also selection for AYOF. Does any one know what the selection criteria for age is as I can't find the wag selection criteria
You have to be born between 1 January 1998 and 31 December 2000
2919There was a poor turnout for this age group. Why would they not all trial?
It can't have been the only trial - Australia has 2 teams of 4 AFAIK. There were barely 8 age eligible girls at national clubs.
Maybe they had a trial at the IDP camp? All of the age eligible kids would have been there.
So typical though that WG is the only gym sport which hasn't posted selection poicies. They barely got the Olympic selection policy up before the trials took place. I would like to think that at least the coaches (all of them) were advised that national clubs was a trial.
AYOF fact sheet.
http://corporate.olympics.com.au/files/dmfile/GymnasticsWAGv2-SportFactSheet.pdf
I'd say that both the WG & MG programs are under some heavy scrutiny at present - coaches positions advertised. Wonder what the trial days will mean for some that have been there for a long long time in reduced training but not competing ... "paying the way" for others is how it looks
Where the 8 girls selected for AOYF 2103 before National Clubs?
I think it would be safe to say Eade and Casis would be the top two girls selected for the AOYF squad
0What about Tamika Jones, Eden Tarvit and Georgia Godwin? They might too?
Tamika jones has left, Georgia Godwin too old
Maddie Leydin?
Too old too
Rhianna mizzen ,eden tarvit ,Grace sheppard are the right age
Eliza freeman and Franceska Fusha too. Also the 10's from WAIS who completed and national clubs.
Oh Eliza has some gorgeous gymnastics!
WAIS are seriously leaving the other HPCs/top tier clubs for dead.
In what way?
1:36 Waverley won the top International Stream club at National Clubs. WAIS came third after Epping. The top programs with the bulk of the gymnasts are WAIS and Waverley but I don't think you can say WAIS is leaving the other clubs for dead.
Last year Qld won every division from IDP 5 to junior there may not be the quantity but they definitely have the Quality .
What I would agree on is that both WAIS and Waverely seem organised and stable in their approach to International Gymnastics .
the team was announced - no casis and fusha only made reserve...
Casis is injured
I wouldn't put too much value on international stream club of the year at national clubs. The HPC's are not eligible as it is the clubs they come from that rmeceive the points not the HPC's.Waverley usually always win by default that no other single club is that big at international levels
is Warnock injured/retired? I'd have thought she'd be in the running
And Waverley is even bigger now that it has absorbed the MLC girls.
No warnock not injured
i hope you're not going to say that Aimee has 'retired' ? She did a wonderful job at Nationals this year
Did she, I recall her not doing all apparatus due to her falling on her head trying to do a double back??
oops
You must be thinking of someone else. Aimee scored 51.075 and 48.85 - She won beam by 3 1/2 points, finished 2nd AA on day 2, she finished 4th AA over both days ahead of 3 girls named to the team. Her floor scores were her lowest - so she may have fallen there - but she was strong on beam and bars.
I know it doesn't really work to compare scores from different comps but her nationals scores would have seen her at national clubs;
AA 2nd
VT 5th
UB 2nd
BB 1st
FX 5th
If she was at national clubs and got those results you would think she would be considered.
Just goes to show that a lot can happen in 6 months - or maybe she just isn't available.
The other IDP 10 who was impressive at nationals and didn't make this team was grace shepherd.
Grace shepherd is injured !
Maybe they should have all competed at National clubs! Why is Franceska WA a reserve though? Haven"t seen Alex Eade for awhile.
Alex is spending time upgrading her skills - Training DTY! Hope she has this ready for AYOF!!!
That would be awesome!!
What a valuable asset a DTY would be. Go Alex!
i think the demographics of gymnastics has changed, it seems to me they are now looking for power not beauty. Maybe this is why Aimee is not going??
I'm sure they would have been looking for the best - shame for those injured. Maybe there will be other appointments in the new year they are working towards - is there an Int calendar anywhere?
I think womens gymnastics is based around power, people don't want to see the usual tumbles and skills they are looking for more. People should look back over the last couple of years and see who and what skills have won National and State Comps and then decide who will be the next leader in Australian Gymnastics. Let's not base it on he said, she said, but what has actually been produced under pressure at State and National meets!!!
How about we base teams on who gets the best scores, not who has the best body type or looks like they might hopefully possibly somehow get better in the future.
Cmon that's laughable, scores mean nothing in Australia, most of the judges are bias. Peggy knows what she is looking for.
If there is a problem with the scores, then the judges need more training so that they get them right. Using scores in the only fair way to select a team, using other more subjective means is totally unacceptable.
Scoring is subjective. And influenced. There are always multiple selection criteria - unfortunately we did not get to see them this time.
Also, it looks like scores were used to some extent. If people didn't come to national clubs to test their routines in the trial - it's no wonder they weren't considered.
The judges know the scoring system. its a matter of whether they score a gymnasts for their gymnastics ability and not were they come from or how they competed in the past. they must feel obligated to score them high. I have seen it at competitions so many times and its frustrating to watch sometimes.
eg: Freeman may not have scored the highest but she is a great tumbler and shes is quick. i believe she has a great future and Peggy can see that. She now needs to be recognized oversea's AYOF is a great opportunity for her.
Fred - if we used scores to pick this team we would have to take all the girls who competed IDP 10 and junior AA - and we would still only have 6 girls I think. Surely you are not suggesting we take scores from 6 months ago at nationals? 6 months is a LONG time in gymnastics!
You people keep talking about Peggy as though she is the Messiah or some brilliant kind of coach. She does not have the nouse or people skills to get the best out of gymnasts and everything she does lacks transparancy. She is way too secretive. She has proved that she is unable to do the job objectively and successfully and the best thing for the sport as a whole in Australia is to get rid of her. Fingers Crossed Here.
Peggy is not the personal coaches of girls nor is she alone in selecting the major teams. She has successfully led teams for many years and worked with coaches and gymnasts to improve the standing of Australian gymnastics. 2012 Olympics was the only glitch. What makes you think she is secretive?
The basis behind my comment is the lack of transparancy by Gymnastics Australia of which she is a major player. I understand she is not a personal coach but she assumes that role as head coach of GA. She may have had some success in the early years but through no input of her own. I have been in a position to watch the tail-hanger onners and brown nosers of hers and it is truly repugnant. How long can a head coach truly survive on past acheivements dating back as far as hers are???
Peggy is very selective in regards to which gymnasts she will take under her wing. When it comes to selecting teams she will choose her "favourites" which has proved not a good choice. Peggy is slowly driving GA into the ground, this is showing in results.
Getting rid of Ju Ping would have had to have been the worst mistake!
Just came back from Melbourne from National Clubs and it was great. We had a ball and the organizers did a great job. The presentations were fun and funky and the girls all thought it was great.
5.27 sound like a dowdell to me
I don't care about Peggy ,all I care about is J. Wieber. You Go girl.
I like how some people think Peggy is the one who knows and the judges can't get it right because Peggy is constantly harrassing judges to change scores. Peggy gets the scores that she wants for each girl...
Oh boy, 2012 Olympics was not the only Peggy glitch. It was not even the biggest glitch.
2000 Olympics- vault meltdown and failure to make team finals
2002 Worlds- failure to put up more than 1 athlete
2004 Olympics- multiple team members competing on serious injuries, prelims errors leading to failure to make team finals and qualify only one athlete to AA outright (the second only got in through injury withdrawal)
2005 Worlds- refusal to send a full team to a home Worlds when the named alternate actually lived in the host city
2006 Commonwealth Games- two athletes falling apart in two different rounds of competition (that both resulted in medals was a sign of the new code and the comparitive lack of competition)
2007 Worlds- massive meltdown across multiple apparatus, failure to make team finals and within 1 place of failing to qualify a full team to the Olympics
2008- several talented and experienced senior athletes retiring just months before Olympic Trials, controversial team selection
2010 Commonwealth Games- meltdown on beam, only winning through other teams choosing to send 2nd string teams
2012 Olympics- controversial team selections and multiple errors leading to failure to qualify to team finals
"2005 Worlds- refusal to send a full team to a home Worlds when the named alternate actually lived in the host city"
Who was the alternate Anon November 24, 2012 11:18 PM?
Thank you Anon November 24, 2012 11:18 PM. This has been my opinion for a VERY long time.
To me, the Australian team have been on a steady decline since 2000. We had such a strong program then, with something like 20 seniors competing at Nationals that year.
Since then, we have gone backwards and only individual results along the way have kept Peggy and Australia looking decent.
I'm in no way having a go at our girls. I think they do a tremendous job. At the end of the day, the girls (and individual coaches to some extent) are told what to do - Peggy needs to take more responsiblity for the things that have gone wrong!!!
I hope we have a new National coach soon.
If you are going to list things here for people to read then give all the facts and allow people to make their own judgement. 2003 world championship bronze. 2005 worlds was not a team event and 3 athletes competed with Monette winning bronze. 2008 Olympics 6th. 2009 worlds silver on floor and beam for Lauren. 2010 worlds 6th and gold on floor.
I agree in 2000 we were so strong! We had so much depth, it was just a pity we didnt perform in Sydney. There were so many good girls at olympic trials.
We havent seen depth anywhere near that since. P.S I would love to see Mark Carlton back at VIS he did an amazing job! producing so much talent
I 110% agree with you anon 7:55.
Time for a change!!! I too completely support our gymnasts and think they do an amazing job considering the amount of pressure certain people put on them. Still so proud of our 2012 Olympians.
It really says something that if you ask most of our Olympians about stress at a major event like worlds or Olympics, they say that performing in front of millions of people doesn't phase them.....the potential wrath of the national coach does....pity, isn't the pressure of millions of people enough?
Have you asked "most if our Olympians?" This would make sense anyway as most of the millions of people have little or no expectations of the Australian gymnasts. Is it so unreasonable that the national coach does?
If the girls have a bad day at comp or things didn't go as planned Peggy can be very nasty. This includes yelling, putting the gymnasts down and compares the gymnasts to other countries most commonly American gymnasts. The girls have enough pressure from there personal coaches let alone the Head Coach.
Marta Karolyi doesn't get results by being warm and fuzzy. Peggy is tough, but so are all the other head coaches.
If that's how soft our girls are they wouldn't last 5 minutes in a Russian, Romanian, Chinese, or American gym. I sincerely hope this is not the case.
In any elite sport the coaches are tough. They are not there to be friends with the girls. All throughout the girls careers they are scrutinised in their routines. This should come as no surprise to any of the girls that the coaches are tough. If they can't handle the heat, get out of the kitchen.
AnonymousNovember 26, 2012 9:05 PM
Your comment shows such a bizarre lack of awareness of how things are in gyms everywhere that I really wonder what your background is. Some gymnasts actually respond to those sort of comments by improving. I have heard that comments like that and much worse too are made in the gym and so often that the gymnasts don't even take them as any more than a metaphorical kick up the bum. Also, why shouldn't the head coach put pressure on the girls? Maybe there isn't enough pressure in some gyms and those girls can't handle the pressure in national team situations? I'm just speculating here but I'm surprised to hear that "most of our Olympians" find the pressure from their head coach affects their performance. I doubt they are so soft after all these years.
In reply to anon 9:05 PM,
Yep, that's the problem.. not enough pressure on our gymnasts. Lets put MORE pressure on them and see what happens.
That was sarcasm by the way.
Look I said I was speculating - just in response to the comment that fear of what Peggy would say to them was having some kind of massive effect on the gymnasts. I think the amount of pressure is about right. But if some people aren't coping with the pressure that is there - maybe that's because they aren't used to it.
My feeling is that if putting pressure on gymnasts wasn't effective - then why is there not one top 4 team who doesn't do so? If another approach is better - then why is no one doing so? Gymnastics demands as close to perfection as possible. That is not going to happen for most gymnasts without some kind of external pressure.
We need to remember that there are 2 types of coaching: putting a carrot in front of the gymnast, or putting a boot behind the gymnast. Just because some (notably communist/former communist countries) have had success with the boot approach doesn't mean it is the only way. I have seen many athletes have greater success (not to mention a healthier state of mind) with the carrot approach.
I I have heard first hand that Peggy's method is to give the "cold shoulder". She praises those who hit consistantly and totally ignores those who don't. Motivation drops, people retire.
I know everyone likes to bag Peggy but for me I like the fact the she knows my daughter, has seen her since she was very young, has been around the country to lots of their competitions to see how they are going and how they are maturing. She might get grumpy when gymnasts she selected don't perform the way she wanted them too but who wouldn't . Peggy is under pressure to perform too ! gymnastics is a stressful sport for everyone involved gymnast , coach, and head coach. Every country is under pressure unfortunately the whole program in Australia needs review especially the coaches many coaches are not progressing gymnasts as they should and hold them back but what are they waiting for these kids want to go for it train like the best do and many get held back by coaches , I realise some of the reasons are to reduce injury but common if the gymnasts are keen and able then they should be working toward the tricks that will put our gymnasts up with the rest of the world. There is no reason we can't match other gymnasts except in the coaching techniques , training etc common Australia lets go for it lets get these girls up with the rest of the world they can do it just give them the opportunity to rise to the occasion and put Australia back on the map !!!
that was come on !! opps auto correct
That's fine but we're not keeping the girls. Sophia Budack (sorry if the speling is wrong) is the perfect example. There is no incentive for young girls coming into their teens, to stay. No prize money at comps, no praise from GA when they achieve. I can think of so many girls with so much talent who have left. Celeste Loo. Where is that very talented girl now? Did Jo even try to keep her. Tierra Exum. Why did she quit? She was beautiful. There needs to be an incentive for these girls to stay. You don't see up and coming rugby players leaving
Well who's taking reponsibility for all the injuries!
Why do you assume these girls leave because of injury or pressure. Tierra had her reasons for leaving of which they were neither
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SlA1SlEdSUg i wonder if marta watched shawn on DWTS
im not a fan of the show but this dance was cool, and the 2012 olympic team danced with her as well!
in reference to the comments about jordyn wieber, she was screwed over by the fact her coach was told she wouldn't be awarded her connections on beam, and even though he had time to fix this, he ignored the advice. gedderts did a great disservice to her!
Just wondering whether anyone knows how the magazine International Gymnast holds up these days? Years ago, it was really the only good, consistent source of information/reports etc....but these days with everything online pretty much immediately....I would imagine the popularity of buying the magazine - wither online or hard copy would have decreased? Anyon know?
So over Peggy, GA and the favoritism to certain gymnasts. So many double standards, different rules for different people and different programs . Some of it so in your face. Hopefully with a new CEO and a change of staff and coaches we may be able to see some continuity. Hopefully we will still have a few Seniors left who have not been put off with the Olympic selection debacle.
thank you captain obvious
Who do YOU think should have been on the Olympic team. What selection debacle are you talking about? Who was better to put on the team? Monckton? Brown? Vivian-with one apparatus?
Post a Comment